Mazza Property Services - Warning

[carvoeiro1]

Maybe Steen could trace Rossi and lewisl 's IP address's and where they really are based, and possibly ID them as the same person.

[rossi]

Maybe he should also check out Sam,Eccles,Lharrop and King, and where are the moderators.................this is getting out of hand and should be stopped and very personnel.

[sam]

There are now 4 of us posting financial irregularities regarding this property management service.
To clarify, I also took the issue up with my solicitor and he is willing to look at not just my documentation, but also others. He has advised that if payment is not forthcoming then legal action can be taken, but would be expensive. As it is likely that we would be throwing good money after bad, it is probably not worth the cost and hassle of taking legal action.

As to misuse of the site, this property management company has been using the site to tout for business and Rossi and LewisL are the ones being personally abusive. Both of these actions are against the code of use for the site.

[Steen Jakobsen]

Maybe he should also check out Sam,Eccles,Lharrop and King, and where are the moderators.................this is getting out of hand and should be stopped and very personnel.

Well since you ask... I can confirm that users Mazza, rossi, lewisl and nah seems to share either IP or email addresses. Sam, Eccles and Lharrop are all known to me.

[sam]

I had a couple of pms from Rossi in early February, the second on the 6th said

Hi Sam
I hope you don't mind me saying, that I and a few others on a forum site are being sued by a agent in Portugal, because of PM's being posted on sites like this, and I have been told by my lawyers that it is looking like we will be paying, as private messages are not private, and you don't know who is at the other end. Just be careful, as I don't want this happening to other people.

Are Rossi and Marion one and the same, or is she Rossi's agent? this gets stranger and stranger.

[sam]

Found this post on the site:-

Cleaning services available
by nah » Sat Apr 21, 2007 7:53 am

Hello
I have sent you a PM but you can email me on mjday001@aol.com as I offer cleaning services.
Thanks

So are 'nah' and Marion Day are one and the same?

[shanagarry]

Can we cut to the chase here - from the evidence supplied - it looks like a 'cut and dried' case of deception. I suspect Portuguese law is not too disimilar to UK law and the offence of deception is a crime and should be reported to the GNR.

For the record Stones Justices' Manual (British Law) defines deception as 'the act of misleading another through intentional false statements or fraudulent actions' and having read the entire string of posts - that's what has happened here.The definition of theft should also be considered 'the act of dishonestly appropriating the property of another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it'' is also relevant here.

The words of Rossi and others defending this reprehensible practice 'stinks' of complicity to me. At no point have they disputed the accusations - merely tried to shout it down in the hope it will go away. I would go as far as suggesting they have a vested interest in Mazza Property Services in the misguided belief it will 'survive' this deserved exposure.

While the GNR are usually labelled as 'impotent' where estrangeiros are concerned - with the balance of 'evidence' (which must be unshakeable and supported by copies of all correspondence) presented here - they have a duty to follow it up. Forget lawyers - that is throwing good money away - I know where I would go next - up the hill to the GNR office - armed with every original document, times, dates, diary notes of conversations - in person.

[Bruce Wallis]

Mazza, Rossi, et al on same IP address?
All operating from some Chinese internet cafe?
All over protesting at an almost unbelievably "Shakespearian" level??

There is an old saying that when something seems to smell rotten, its because something IS rotten!!!

This issue is so serious that I believe it ought to be reported officially and an investigation and possible action be taken in law.

We owners need to have total trust in our management companies. We cant afford to have a bad apple in the basket.

[shanagarry]

Globetrotter - you might end up getting references from Rossi and his gang - if you're not careful

This site is very useful and provides a 'quality'' public service (I know some will disagree) by keeping all of us informed of developments in and around Carvoeiro - long may it continue.

Well done Steen for supporting this exposure of a diservice that could impact all of us who trust the security of our investment to people like Mazza Property Services.

Fortunately there are many reputable, reliable and honest property management companies in Carvoeiro - let us be careful and not 'tar' them all with the same brush.

[lharrop]

Many thanks to shanagarry for his very full except from law journals.

The police in town have been informed by me in person after they told me to present myself at their offices with all the evidence as well as have an interpreter present.

I journey to Portugal to keep this appointment as well as take my new managing agent with me. You are right-there are some really good ones around and they should not all be tarred with the same brush.

The police made an attempt to track her down but with a false address, no listing in any phone books or business register it proved difficult for them.

They then phoned her on the mobile number as well as land line that is in use for all her contacts to make an appointment with her and she denied she was Marion Day and hung up on them.

[shanagarry]

lharrop - therein lies the answer - not that we didn't know - all of you who have had the misfortune to trust Mazza Property Services aka Marion Day are the victims of a scam masquerading as a Property Services business.

Given the nature of the trust needed in such an arrangement, can I suggest to Steen that he keeps a 'Notice Board' on this site naming all the reputable management companies as well as a warning list of those to avoid. This 'Notice Board' should contain the names of the reference providers, their addresses (UK and Portugal) and countersigned by somebody (a moderator) of some standing who can vouch for the integrity of the information and has seen/met the people involved. I have seen many posts on here over the years from families looking for introductions/recommendations to/for property managers and not being aware that the likes of Rossi and his gang are out there waiting to steer the unsuspecting in the direction of Mazza/Marion Day.

It is low-life like this that need to be hunted down and imprisoned for the damage they do to the reputation of us estrangeiros. In addition to the losses incurred by the property owners - which doubles up - as they have to make restitution to the local tradesmen, maids etc - there is considerable 'loss of face' to the rest of us because the maids etc think we are all the same - it's despicable.

It's such a serious undertaking - that some form of legislation needs to be introduced to protect us all. In the absence of Portuguese legislation - let us draw up our own 'rules of engagement' and introduce a 'Best Practice' guide to help. Approaching AFPOP to promote it might be a good starting point?

There can't be any good to come out of this but hopefully we will never hear from the Rossi gang again - unless he registers using another identity - over to you Steen.

[laserblazer]

can I suggest to Steen that he keeps a 'Notice Board'

Shouldn't this been down tothe Residents Associations?

[shanagarry]

What 'Resident's Association'?

[Steen Jakobsen]

There is a number of villa management agents advertising on this site, they're all registered businesses and pay taxes. Their rates will reflect the cost of running a business legally but why should it be otherwise?

[shanagarry]

Steen - while I respect your comment it is not the point;

As a public service you should put in place a device that prevents the likes of Mazza 'winning' business. I realise you can't 'vet' every person wanting to establish a business but I do believe you should have some form of 'early warning. It doesn't have to accusatory - something along the lines of 'you should be aware that' under a pseudonym that would only be available to those who register their full names, addresses etc. I can hear the sceptics now - 'what about unscrupulous competitors bad mouthing the competition' - that is for the moderators to weed out.

Just a thought