Where has the tourism gone?

bife73 · Post by **bife73** » Mon Mar 05, 2007 7:15 pm

With my humble businesses, and colleagues I know here and in the UK who deal directly or indirectly with tourism are all saying the same. Tourism in the Algarve is slowly dying (at least the quality tourism). Year by year we seem to just accept the fact tourist season gets shorter and shorter..... The tourist that do visit return on a less frequent basis, and just for the week. As a fortnight is just too expensive!
The arrival of the Euro, the general lack of quality on offer (in general) is finally taking its toll. Look at our lovely village....unfinished building work in numurous streets, run down buildings in need of repair (or at least a lick of paint), the constant pong of smelly drains...to name just a few offences!
Businesses are unable to thrive due to being over taxed, too much red tape...and just not enough investment from local government. Just look at our neighbours in Spain, lower taxes, large investment where it counts, where it is needed.....not into football grounds left to stand empty! But we can't just blame others we need more local businesses to offer quality with a smile. Rather than the exact opposite. Yes that means you & me!!
I love the Algarve I've lived here over 20 yrs, my wife is Portuguese and my daughter was born here. I'm lucky to have a successful business & live in a beautiful country with such friendly people... I just hope it lasts, as each year I see things slip just that bit further!
I hassle the Junta de Freguesia on a regular basis, with ideas and points of concern. I feel it just falls on deaf ears....We need to take more interest in our villages future if it is to have one!

Ellie · Post by **Ellie** » Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:30 pm

Hello Bife

Yes, I love the Algarve too and consider it my second home, Carvoeiro and Lagoa especially mean a lot to me, not only cos I once lived there but cos Ive made so many friends in those places over the years (mainly through this site

)

If you are speaking of the amount of British tourists, that are not making so many visits, I think you have to take into account the cost of living now in the UK. We have interest rates at 5.75% now (think thats correct)and looks like going up again to 6% this coming thursday.
By April this year our local Council Tax here will be £110 a month (compare that to that of Portugal?)....and lord knows what it is in our cities and other parts of the UK!
Theres also the added airport tax.
Parent can't take children out of school now for holidays at the cheaper times of year..they have to go during school holidays which makes it very expensive for those with kiddies( I know this from my own family..the grandchildren)
When you add all this up, specially those who have mortgages to pay and children at school, then it isn't very likely that families can afford many holidays to somewhere like the beautiful Algarve..and visits are limited.

But you seem very concerned that local businesses are not doing their best to attract tourists?That they could do better?
Ive always seen Carvoeiro as a lovely little village thats ideal for family holidays, with everything within easy reach..beach, restaurants, shops,friendly folk...a perfect little spot

But sometimes it just boils down to plain old economics..and maybe folk here in UK don't have the cash to spend as much time there as they (we) would like?

tricky · Post by **tricky** » Mon Mar 05, 2007 11:08 pm

I have to say, I've noticed that there are fewer and fewer posts on the development (resorts) section. Not many questions about any of the hotels or appartments for quite some while. It is worrying but the world is getting smaller and with the increased advent of low cost airlines to long haul destinations it was bound to happen. Won't last though, when people realise that the Algarve has the best beaches and the friendliest people in the world!

(and no jet lag)

Ellie · Post by **Ellie** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 12:09 am

Picking up on Bife's words and I quote "just for a week as a fortnight is just too expensive"!
I think that answers for itself and something Ive never understood..the very high price of renting an apartment for a week in CVO when I know from sources, that some will stand empty?..I just don't understand the wisdom in that

Why not lower the price?
Maybe I shouldn't compare as I don't know all the ins and outs but its a bit of a mystery to me...how come I can rent a small apart. in Alvor overlooking the beach, for less than half the price of that in Carvoeiro and at the same time of year?(Sept)
Can anyone explain that to me please?
I know of quite a few people,friends who only come out to CVO for a week as they can't afford more.
I think its a bit sad really, as Carvoeiro is an ideal family holiday spot and if it was a bit cheaper and more within the budget of the average family Im absolutely sure there would be more visitors.
Thats just my personal opinion.

dodger · Post by **dodger** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:49 am

I agree about the rental prices.....this year for the apartment we stayed in last year and paid £630 for the 2 weeks they are looking for £800!! I have therefore booked into the big yellow hotel half way up the hill (name I don't remember) for £430 B &B for both of us!! Surely at these prices they shall have vast weeks that wll stand empty??

Viking · Post by **Viking** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 10:06 am

I´ve been working towards the Portuguese textile business since the
late 80´s. Problem there was that the money that was made during
the good years, was not reinvested to cope with a rainy day.

When we visit Algarve, I feel there are about the same thing that was
available 15-20 years which are still being offered, only difference is
the quality and service is the same, the only thing that has changed is
the prices which for sure has increased much more then the inflation
over the years. In all business today, you have to offer more for the
same income, Í think it can be applied on the tourism too. But I do not
see that in the Algarve, I see people and businesses possibly increasing
prices to manage on the crowds still coming instead of trying a fresh
approach. Then again, this is not easy for the single restaurant/bar-owner,
small hotel owner to control, it has to be a policy-decision by the
Government. Maybe also the Algarve is relatively cheap if £ is your
home-currency, but for people from Scandinavia, it is considered a
costly place to visit. People go to Spain, Turkey, Greece where you get
the same sun, there´s also beaches and water to swim in. Even if you go
to Thailand, as many Scandinavians do, yes you have to cope with the
jet-lag and the long journey, but a fortnight there is less then a fortnight
in the Algarve when you calculate the total cost. But there are also other
incentives then the mere cost and that is exactly what the tourism in the
Algarve has to be able to show for! As it is now, it is expensive rather
then value for money in my opinion.

/
Viking

tbbr · Post by **tbbr** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 5:52 pm

If you fly from Bristol as often as we and see so few empty seats as we do. See the year on year increase in the number of golfers ( not short of money ) who visit the algarve.
Notice the increase we have also seen in bookings for this summer from May to September it is difficult to agree with the picture others paint of the tourist industry.
The Algarve has become a short break destination for 7 months as has most of mainland europe.

Is there any REAL evidence of a fall in numbers ??.

bife73 · Post by **bife73** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 7:41 pm

I work in the travel industry myself..... A lot of the companies I work with here and in the UK have felt a sudden drop in interest in the Algarve. Just take a look on a couple of the big tour operator websites (which i have check on a regular basis), there availabilty is enormous!! Usually by March at least most of July & August is fully booked!
Things are grey....but as mentioned here if everyone just put in a little more effort (in the smaller local businesses), service with a smile!! It makes all the difference to a holiday maker... Look how Spain has improved its image. All too often I speak to guests who have had a hellish holiday here....they don't blame the individual who wronged them. Poor meal, rude waiter, poorly maintained villa/apartment, building work next door. They blame the Algarve!
If everyone hassles local authorities to make things right.....a few more plants to liven up the high street, like in Lagoa. Force some of the blocks to redecorate the buildings so they don't look so shabby. Quickly paint over the ever growing graffitti problem. Force builders to complete projects and keep the sites clean (or just fence them off). It could make things so much more attractive!
But we all need to take an active role, and voice our opinions with Jorge at the Junta....Or at the local Camara....I have but one voice isn't enough!

tbbr · Post by **tbbr** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:42 pm

You are right in that with the trend away from the " package " tour and big holiday companies it is up to the " destinations " to market themselves.
I have never seen ( or has anyone ) any promotion of the type that Spain, Turkey, Greece, THailand, Malaysia and so on do.
Has the Tourist ministry in Portugal/Algarve a budget on this scale?

One other thought , as the package tour numbers decline so do the number of occupied Hotel beds.
Any co incidence in the campaign to tighten up on the private rental.
Who would gain if there are fewer private rentals on the market ???.

SHOWWWIE · Post by **SHOWWWIE** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 10:21 pm

My two cents: Portugal doesn't do enough to promote winter get aways to the Canadian and American retiree markets. (As I write to you, it is about minus 18 C and the wind chill nearly minus 35 and I am and have been having severe Portugal withdrawal because of other commitments this winter. But I can assure you there are many more Canadians who would really appreciate a month in the Algarve, especially Carvoeiro, if they knew what a Canadian friendly people live and work there and how easy it really is to do.

Many think of Portugal as a country which would be hard to get around in because of unfamiliar roads and language. We have not found this to be the case at all and I just hope we can return soon. In the meantime, Portugal needs to sell itself more in Canada.

I am of two minds as I send this contribution because I fear that, with a great influx of Canadians, the prices will go up!

Finally, like Ellie and others, it is indeed a source of wonderment why apartment prices are so high and yet most of them sit there empty during the hard cold winter months. Doesn't make sense to me. Not that they aren't affordable I guess but we sure would like to stay longer if we could just make our dollars go a little further. The longer stays would not just benefit us surely.

Glasllwch · Post by **Glasllwch** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 11:21 pm

We come as often as we can, probably twice/three times a year.

One thing I have notice, and have raised the subject befroe is the amount of graffiti around.

My 5 year old son even comments on it.

Bad for the image of a lovely area.

I really believe that the authorities must take a grip urgently.

We travel to other places in Europe throughout the year , and whilst graffiti is not unique to the area ,it is more prevalent than anywhere purporting to be a holiday destination that I have seen.

tricky · Post by **tricky** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 11:41 pm

I'm am in the travel marketing business and each year visit the World Travel Market in London, this is the largest travel trade exhibition in the world with every destination you have ever heard of and many that you won't have heard of exhibiting and promoting their destinations and hotels. The Algarve Tourist Association stand is amongst some of the least interesting there, just a few desks on a large stand promoting hotels. Not regions or towns. in late 2006 the Portuguese tourist authority did have a small advertising budget that they spent on a few full page colour national ads and some bus advertising. Not enough!.
National TV advertising is what is needed for the Algarve, but unfortunately tourist boards rely on funding from contributions from hotels and resorts and if its not forthcomming........
It is up to the individual tourist boards to co-ordinate fund raising, but hey this is Portugal we are talking about..

SJ & RE · Post by **SJ & RE** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:51 am

Hiya Tricky,
Maybe u can help me. I would love 2 go back 2 Saudi on a holiday. I know it has now opened up in the vacation market & wondered if u can help please.

Re CVO, so 2 many apts are left vacant over the winter months, is this going 2 have 2 alter my plans 4 a rental place 2 purchase as I was banking on it being let out 90% of the time and us 2 coming over 4 the remaining 10% of the time. Help

laserblazer · Post by **laserblazer** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:12 am

SHOWWWIE wrote: But I can assure you there are many more Canadians who would really appreciate a month in the Algarve, especially Carvoeiro, if they knew what a Canadian friendly people live and work there and how easy it really is to do.

I would imagine the other problem is that Florida or the Caribbean is a lot warmer than the Algarve in winter and probably works out cheaper for Canadians.

SHOWWWIE · Post by **SHOWWWIE** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 4:05 pm

Yes . . . but the Algarve experience is far superior - very pleasant weather, not too hot, safe, the continental touch, fabulous views, often cheaper and far more excellent food and wine. Just an overnight flight away.

A growing issue: crime and the conditions in the South of our hemisphere.

For example, thousands of Canadians flock to Mexico every winter. But they will be the first to tell you they get more nervous every year as stories of murder and mayhem pop up, and the corruption there becomes so evident. Friends of ours were held hostage last year in a resort that had been damaged in a hurricane. They were held hostage by the workers who had completed the repairs but never been paid. A dangerous stand off ensued. These sort of stories are multiplying. The poor conditions throughout the Caribbean are really very depressing whether you are there on a cruise, touring or staying at a resort.

And the Americans have made border crossings a very unpleasant experience over the past few years. The C&I people body search grannies, yell at you, and now they require passports for air travel and next year for all travel. So the passport requirements are now almost the same. A lot of Canadians are fed up with the States and especially Florida which is overbuilt, full of poor hispanics, drug issues, not to mention high prices for everything. The Florida experience has changed quite a bit in the past few years - and not for the better.

It's the Algarve for me.

I probably don't need to tell you that the marketing for the US, Carib and Mexico is huge. I would say it is probably at least twenty to one over the Algarve. It's a big and expensive obstacle for you folks.

If you could persuade an airline like Sunwing or Zoom to start weekly flights to Faro in addition to the two or three that do it now that would be a big factor I would think.